It's time for Cummins not get with your host Michael kargil. Brought to you by Texas law shields. Over the last decade Michael has championed and supported the rights of law abiding Texans to own and use firearms he is the owner of central Texas gun works a veteran of the united states army and has achieved national exposure and such prestigious media outlets such as Forbes magazine. Fox Business news CNN money. AOL BBC world news Huffington Post and the New York Times. Cargill vigorously defends lawful gun ownership in this country without regard to party politics and now here's Michael kargil. Good afternoon. Austin, Texas the live music capital of the world let's play and praised them for lung capacity ammunition. IRA so today we have attorney Gordon Cooper from US laws she'll on the phone. Gordon we'll chat with does about the imitate process. And the national firearms act. And so let me tell you a little bit about the national firearms act of 1934. And it requires the registration that's right. So your firearms that you purchase need to be registered with the federal government. And bill's gonna be your fully automatic firearms term machine guns are rifles and shotguns and have an overall length under 26 inches. Rifles with a barrel under sixteen inches. Shotguns with the barrel under eighteen inches. And farm shouts oppressors terms how what's yours melding gun control act of 1968. It and it place destructive devices primarily explosives. Now all but also including firearms over fifty caliber other than most shotguns. Under the provisions of the NF ain't. In 1994. That Treasury Department place revolving cylinder shotguns and one semi automatic shotgun under the in FA list. The gun control act of 1968. Prohibited the importation of fully automatic firearms for private purposes. Any 96 amendment to the act prohibited their domestic manufacturer. Of fully automatics for private purposes however. Shot barrel rifles and shotguns have become increasingly popular. For home defense and defensive skills based marksmanship training and competition and and sounds oppressors have become increasingly popular for mark to ship trainee and competitions and for twenty. Now before I welcome born to show. Let me go to my my cohost deny. It's an idea tell Lee because you know a little bit about the of the history behind the NFA act there. Yeah I was reading earlier. In 1934 when they passed it isn't do is. In part. For tax revenue but. The other issue at hand was. There's a lot of gangster activity so congress who you know the whole saint Valentine's Day massacre. Which as I mentioned to you earlier is one of my relatives. MCI could echoed each name is to nine Seattle once you get me. That's just kill you guys know I've we have a mob ties here most of the so don't don't trade thing is that Michael holes you know she's related to the Marshall we'll get chance yes my grandmother was Al Capone cousin. So while anyway. That is so in response to all the gangster activity. Congress wanted to curtail the activity of of sales of those types of guns and so. That's why they've they've imposed at 200 dollar fine which as we're talking about earlier would be. Equivalent to 3600 dollars in today's dollars while. And that's a lot you know you talk in 200 dollars back in you know 1934. And so then that's a lot now you know Steve Ford 2017. That's crazy I sort I sort all this stuff out and to help us sort this out we're gonna bring Gordon Cooper with Texas in US law she old. And Gordon started college at the University of Houston at thirteen years old where he attended undergrad and law school that's right. He attended the University of Houston at thirteen years so not Gordon he's real modest he's not gonna say he's a child prodigy or anything like Abbott and tell you. Gordon is at this guy is so Smart I just he's it's insane. Paso and he was the youngest graduate on record the year at the University of Houston and Gordon Cooper. I wanna walk into the come talk to sir are you doing this weekend. And they think like I'm doing well at yup. I feel bad getting the duty had their setup. You don't things. That's a gay and LA gay got to give credit where credit is due you know it it is what it is. I'd so Gordon they'll help us sort all this stuff out the national firearms act. If people going crazy right now they wanna get their hands on a machine gun they wanna get a Salinger or suppressor. They want to you you don't turn a rifle into. An SPR no so how do we go about doing this process. Sure there is you know you have to keep in mind there was a huge rule over all that happened and then went into effect last year. And to really understand the impact of what we have to do now I think it's helpful to talk a little bit about let you know we used to have to do not so long ago. So the old girl the other rule that's not an attack right now over the golden rule was if you wanted to get one of these items like let's say you wanted to express are seeing it here take this thirty years they are great. They wanna get this presser I'm youth and Warren have basically two options. You could buy it as an individual. Which. Entails paying a 200 dollar checks of the government like dole talked about. I'm yes there are some forms that are not party etiquette fingerprinted and photographed that's kind of absolutely like I mean you hate seeing your picture but otherwise manage. I'm but the worst part of it what you had to get cheap foreign force are not certain signature and they had to agree. But you're gonna use this side and for unlawful purposes now. And you can imagine making a lot of people Potts needs as we you know I imagine you're in that that chief law enforcement officers Putin's. Do you really want to sign a piece of paper saying you don't think this person mentally and along with the I don't. Yeah I'm I mean imagine you sign off on somebody gets not a machine gun and on the go you know shoot up a smaller or commit some other kind of atrocity that says here's a paper up there with your name on it. And especially since Jeff first aren't friends as she says that position your position can be elected position. Yeah exactly I mean it's a cracker thing you can come under your reelection. Process of that piece of paper where he signed up for. The best person to get that. Found and then other you know kind of limiting factors. To get this signature other than that kind of liability aspect. I'm a lot of chief law enforcement officers and their own political views you know Dave didn't think that's civilian and needed these sorts of weapons. For some of them you don't just leaned there one particular direction when it came to gun rights then and you expect. And the end result of that a lot of people were not able to get care. Forms signed off on Friday she wants port enforcement officers and assorted happening right thumb which is why there's a huge jump. QB secondly purchasing which would certainly trust or corporation. If you purchased at one of these entities. Obviously you have to format which you know other than the unpleasantness of dealing with an attorney wouldn't have bad. Do you gauger trust corporation formed and you trial has a trust or corporation. And a huge miniature what do you didn't have to get that she's more unfortunate cops are signature. All you had to provide ready tres store articles in corporation documents TV government should pay the 200 dollar tax cuts. Yes you can figure a way not kept paychecks the government can you give me a call after this show until we know it's sad that I'm sitting still had to pay the tax. Not having to get that signature was the difference between being able to move forward and just basically being denied right out of the gate. And so that was the process for a very long to happen. Until last year. Now go before you go old siege what happened after you know the change in July 13. 2016 before we talk about that some people. We'll walk into the shop you know ask me about the discount in discounted price. Blank is there a hundred dollar fee that I can pay instead of 200 dolls are seeking Dallas feet. For eagle certain trees are turning. Yet the only time there's a different thing in the actually got to pay the government. Is it pure cream turn what's called an DOW or any other weapon. Now that's sounds great but a UW or any other weapon does not mean any other weapon that you think it's a very specific data list of types of weapons. That range from. Things that don't look like guns but are secretly yum it's like umbrella again fan and I stand and things of that nature. I'm or items that pushed who you know Al player as far as they Kiev was concerned they put them into this category. For example. But I believe the marble being getter has. So smooth door on top and a rifle boron bottom and it was just kind of this weird animal until they thought they did they would be category. For whatever reasons the transfer those types of items is only a five dollar tax. But that's only the trying to turn right if I may get you Adobe is still 200 bucks. Men likewise there's no. You know. There's no other way out of the 200 dikes for the fractures are short barreled weapons or machine gun this letter says that you can really can't continue. Okay and then you guys have questions I see a lot of people are typing things on line Nike until of these legitimate questions or not he had a legitimate question. Deathly give us a call our number is 5126435483. That's 5126435483. I come in talking right so and so Gordon now and July 13. 2016. We had a change. Yes you're the massive change. And we ended up where they're ruled that kind of borders almost on the identical but they kind of you know here to wait the last second country are having it you know common sense legislation. I'm the good news was that these cheats or enforcer not your signature requirement went away. For individuals that found its toll on you don't have to get approval before you can send in your order so the government anymore. What they required now is notification. All you have to do is let the chief law enforcement option no such you're entering into this process and it's far is that the process is concerned you can check that box you're done would that particular step. I'm not. The bad news is that it's a little more tedious if you have a trusts. Because what you have to do now is also even if you have a trust story corporation. You still have to notify the chief law enforcement officer let your area. And that brings true not only for the except Laura Laura. The main person in charge of the trust. But training wheels from the trashed it stands now that the item other than beneficiary somewhat places it's quick and get an authorization possess the out of before the end of the trust. So all co trustees. Successor trustee is only so it's strokes. Now have to notify their chief law enforcement option that they're in tremendous process on top of that. Everyone in a trust they have acquired corporation I you know today's so called responsible person anyone who can. You know I've trained through the items that SCI and things of that nature. Not only do they have to notify they're they're Korea they also have to submit sort of ratcheting the prince can be ATF's so they HE if we run a background check off. So there's a lot more out of paperwork and make involved know. And I guess it was sort of left. What's good for the individual is good for everybody sort of perspective. But it definitely beats out the key initial version of the rural. Which was kind of require chief law enforcement officers signature for everybody you know crush or otherwise I think. It's it's a lot of paperwork and a lot of hassle but it's not as bad as I could have been. Okay and then what about theme you know so the fee for the OW is going to be still the same. You know all the trees are still the same it's still with cornerbacks they haven't you know. But thankfully they haven't adjusted for inflation or anything like that. It's still just the same amount that would certainly backward and bad. Do you think the main change here I just. Entirely notifying the Cleo instead of having made its signature cheer an individual. And now. At one and trust us to get through that's for regular overall what you get your pretty picture taken intimidate the idea. Okay now we're talking what Gordon Cooper go to Gordon Cooper is an attorney with Texas a US law shields. And Gordon actually attended the University of Houston at thirteen years old and so Gordon is actually loud and a sellout fours and we come back from the break. We're gonna act she take it from the beginning we're gonna go from you know if your purchasing that I done. Frowned and maybe online somewhere. You know what's the process it takes to get used the gun restored you're gonna get it from Indian TU. Got to take that item option we're gonna walk through that whole process talk about the paperwork all the different forms form threes form fours quick break that down for yet this is Michael Cargill and you. It's hard listen to come and talk. Ticket Britney glazed and I guess my level of venues that Michael cartels aren't coming top kids. Welcome back to common socket and now here's Michael's car guild. All right so we're talking when Gordon Cooper. Gordon is what Texas and US law shields and Gordon just talk until sabathia in the face processed and national firearms act. Top process and how to get that done how you gonna get that automatic. How do you. Possess are only eight short barreled rifle and Heidi get your hands on the suppressor. Let me go to deny first and I would guess and questions online here. Yeah Tom has a question what percentage or crime is being committed with class three items. So so Gordon gee he's you know any statistics at Ole. You know. You assume the likely hit back she's someone actually commit a crime within FA item in the history behind that don't. Yeah I don't have that exact number offhand but I can tell you gets from my own you know personal. Survey at a recent you know men shooting at the end to end. Other you know violent crimes. In my either not the other years I mean. In the Adam DC take place in this current events are items that are easily attained and items that you can you know a bit but really there's been nothing special. Because at the end of the day how we want to do something that Steve introduce on the next. And eldest son tedious way Q did you go I'm ultimately though you know these are definitely sort of each item's. And if you're not gonna see just pop up and there's many crimes that you are more easily obtain firearms so now I can infect. Just personally I can't think Jones you know. I have. Evidence that it involved any kind of in a sale items are cans. Yeah and and Tom basically. The likelihood of someone actually go into this entire process you're talking. You know six months seven months eight months however long it's gonna be right now imbued with the new rules and everything. So one going to the entire process of getting one of these items are automatic machine gun. Getting eighty suppress your getting a shoulder a rifle get that EOW mingling commit the crime within. That is just insane. That the team dissent is just electric is only unanimous that money is just crazy would you say Gordon. Are very patient criminal is a very patient criminal. OK so lad so Gordon so let's let's talk about this all right so. Now I go online and I'm searching on line I'm looking for gain and look at foreign. I notice any OW and only can do complicated we're goals simple so look I'm I'm looking for in a machine gun now. I want to what's the likelihood of me being able team turned one of my rifles into a machine gun. Is that possible. Yeah this is a great question. I don't know if you if you prime real machine you heard it or by accident ideas. Machine can definitely are one of the most common questions are yet. Because what happens you know. Let's say I want to go by machine yet and I go online and how we broke these things cost 161000 dollar additional madam out. I'm anti woman and round she got because you know I've got a wide hole and it's relatively chief says to do it on my own so I should be able to do that right. Reportedly entered wrong dead wrong. Federal felony level wrong. So there's a law in place that prohibits the purchase I think machine guns or indeed the registration of any machine guns and many are manufactured after 1986. So yes. You make a machine yen today from you know he grabbed a rifle on top sitting down carrier against Anthony deal that if you don't make it. That's very very bad you that we talked to many in exchange wants. Because someone actually run assembled slaughtered today what do you want me to do that and they certainly every option. Option number one has destroyed immediately. Option number two didn't he bring tasks and will destroy Torre. And I'm sure they would gladly arrest and mom spot and an option three was buried in the ground I don't I never tried to. So that it the global level of scrutiny you're under treaties to which they. So you tell me that if he and my great grandfather. You know I'm going to do he's items and I come across an NSA I don't. That is not been registered is not in the system. You tell me there's no way I can make that legal at all. That is the harvesting correct there was an amnesty period I'm not going back in the eighties. But there have been more intense and beyond that I don't see one happening on up on the horizon either there have been no announcing mr. experience. And so we've seen that happen all the time to where people have their grandfather's. You know world war shotgun. Or you know one guy I didn't realize that. If they page paper weight on his desk that he thought was a secret it but turned out to be a real civil war critic. Absolutely that's. Very very excited that I have that information out but again don't care for the very very stringent on the angels. And they'll tell you if you wanna keep it gets sentimental reasons so we're glad that letter hardened to it again could ever be fixed. But otherwise get your commended federal felony. Well okay now so I'm gonna have to go online and purchase this machine guy and then. I saw one goal line and do my Google search here and I find a dealer that actually has there were they may have this machine guns and I've been dying for awhile. So they're dealer looking in a totally different states. So I'm gonna have to have them shipped it to me. Right so I can just just like Leo the transfer I can just contact then dealer pay for that item right now in this have a ship it to me right rattling. Well so again here. And I know you're doing the proper. Now there's there's actually more steps that have to happen so we still got the basic you know other than they get a process of going you know filing forms mobile block. And it's still treated a lot like eight. Safe firearm in that you have to pass a school record seven degree even sort of pressure which is strange to me. Because of what you're gonna hits when they can't let it it's not really a weapon as far as lack concerns eased but you know it is what it is so. Again you'll have to get it transferred to. Let us know when you were steady to and that's yours the first you can pick it up from bad. That is another thing your country very popular web site a lot of people to a very good job on me exactly what they want on there. But there and made no except in the purchasing process he has don't get to be extremely careful to make sure you know vote for a buyer and seller because both people can get in trouble. I'm that your not becoming an illegal importer. Or dealer floor track record but firearms in the process. You get so so we're getting contact that dealer is gonna pay for it and then that dealer on the other end. They're gonna fill out a form three and they gonna form three that to you my gun store. Or can be done sir that I wanna pick it up from. So they gonna Dion performs three at and what seg gets approved which probably takes about. Thirty knees. Maybe a little longer depending on you know what's going on maybe 45 days thirty days. Biggest form three and then once stayed received approval league gets approved to transferred from one gun store to the other. Then one step arrives at my guns story and I'm gonna take an up. Then that gun stores I can didn't start the process. Do in the form four. I didn't get up get the form for filled out and do my fingerprints. And give my sure us now on I hacked. As of the July 13 rule I have to get the truck straight so every once in week we did actually happen to the trust is no way around that trust at all. No no not true you can definitely say you still that you can purchase an individual you can purchase could edit Trappist. We can emerges as a corporation. I was a little it's really it's allegedly at let's say I wanna purchase it as an individual. How does that work. So all you have to do you. Bill Wendy's or for which estate transfer form from Maine you know ask ourselves to an individual someone that's filled out. You'll just trending topic and your chief law enforcement officers. You know because they've updated forms thankfully and they're the portion that's. For the dealer can't live. That area until he has still let down and send it in here good again. You do lose some benefits. Filing as an individual that you couldn't retains if you worry trust or a corporation. If you do file as they trust or corporation. He had to do that same individual process for everybody in the trusts and corporations so if you get your you know crede doesn't need him. Do you know got. Split amplified felonies twenty years ago and pass a background check. It's probably better to lead him off the press break and be calm but otherwise you can ask you know carrying people you. They caught stealing data and run away from you you can happen in the trap. And they get to follow this process but it everyone goes through it everything is passed and everyone passes the background check. I'm anyone in that trust and possessing items so if your cousin. Once again auditorium to go I don't know outside in you'd rather stay you don't hear cozy warm bed. Figure in a tragic ending that you can direct your and I trust. You can have distress or bill lately hello I'm however if you purchase the item has an individual you have to be there we can't supervising. Amity just taken walked out there than being committing itself. I'm so he had a you know try to get their core AM we are couldn Greta basically gonna watch this guy so that's. One of the main benefits of purchasing and they trust her recuperation. As just sort of that freedom means letting other people use the item when you're not around. Okay so we're gonna do so we're gonna do it as a trust and guess I'm gonna get my trust me and I I'm gonna name my mother and my father my sister and my brother. You know the whole family in the trust so that means that everyone's got to come in and it was under the fingerprints done. And everyone's got to get their picture taken. So weekend turn all that paperwork in. Yes now that's true for the first time minutes you know I can't say that they can be astle Langham people and then herding cats to get him to go get their pictures taken their fingerprints. Taken. But they didn't it is that you only have to do that once. Every two years and so he's cute let's say you buy expressed or did they go through that process every once and all the stats and the ATF. The next time you wanna buy something. If it hasn't been more than two years since the last time you applied the ATF or use the same fingerprints and photographs that we're seeing them previously so it does make it a little bit easier. But the very first time Yankee I have ever. And old we do we actually have a kiosk and are lobbying sounds you're shot kiosk. So with the kiosks you can actually come in deep fingerprints on the kiosk. There and there's an app that you download on your phone and you make sure you're standing on that he had a white background. And you can take your your passport type photo. And then you can use and and that gets submitted. And it goes it stays in the system and sounds you shop and so whenever you do anything you know they use those. He's at information neared the connected to your item. And then turn in the paper work for you and you pain the feed online. And you can you know you can go to Texas law she'll get your trust at Texas a US law shields and turning that paperwork mailed emailed and end. In old you don't turn everything else in and then we just have to sit back and wait for the tax stamp to come in. Rich so. So good so Gordon. I'd sold that's that's the process for getting the they're automatic. And if I have a trust. So they end you know Wilson of the process if we don't wanna do is trust wand is individual. And what's the third option. So the third option is to do it the corporation I mean and then since. Feeling in my personal opinion aside to choose between now. I Tressel corporation don't go the trust. But basically corporation had the same benefits as. And then you can ask agents of the corporation you're able to possess the item when you're not around. The downside though is that it is a corporation a company until you gotta pay your you know he's had access to your. Governmental systems you know and in that's great so what can happen now is that people are forget you know it's unfortunate acolytes. That sometimes we just forget to do to. And if you forget to body you know your corporate taxes senior corporation disappears from an any key. Well the only lawful owner of pure in a hay Adams says yes he's still yet. Ku band now there are no other way you treated train turned aside a legally because a person that had a before you that it exists anymore and your guess stuck with these. You know. These items that are turning you under criminal Brady yet to destroy him. Oh wow. Oh OK and we come back have and I'm gonna ask you about what what happens if you move. And you move from one state to another is there anything that we have to do with that. Also we're gonna talk about you know what happens if you wanna add someone to the trust or what happens if you need to remove someone from the trust. Has we'll talk about all those different little details also. And we're talk it would Gordon Cooper. Gordon is the he's a child prodigy Gordon is the actually attended the University of Houston at thirteen years old. And Gordon is telling us about the NSA process how to get our hands on the machine gun. How to purchase that sound sir that's oppressor how to get that EO WE Neal the weapons. This is Michael Cargill and you are listening to come and talk it. He's it is my great you Lipton it's common dog radio what Michael Clark. Welcome back to come and talking with Michael Cargill. We're talking all things firearms now here's Michael kargil and now it's time for GG in the. The movie and music global Dendy sponsored by central Texas gun works. The largest online guns stored in Texas. In the knee is trending desk. I gunshots for years has occurred in a majority of large metropolitan areas such as New York Los Angeles and of course the notorious gang territories of Chicago. A substantial majority of the proportion of the gun murders and knees and similar locations. He's committed by individuals using pistols semi automatic and revolvers alike. Recently though for unknown reasons there's been a striking popularity amongst gangs for the use of semi automatic rifles. In just the past nine months 33 shootings involved in two neighborhoods in Chicago have been committed with AR an AK style rifles. While the number of incidents has most certainly not risen past the murder rate if pistols there seems to me in major spike in news. Back in 2014. Rifles didn't even break the top twenty list of most seized types of guns. To contact trust that in the past three months police have seized three rifles from gang members. Or suspected gang members and daring district in Chicago. The Hispanic gangs are La Raza and the almighty saints have been a war for years and along with a gangster two sixes and statements disciples seem to be the gangs that are more privy to the enhanced fire power. The question of course is why now. Legislatively there's been no change that would incur such a switch and it's not as if the lethal potential of the semi auto was underestimated up until now. So was the beginning of a new trend and if so what is the cause. While Canada itself is not known to be as pro gun or gun friendly as its southern ally. There's a distinct gun rights population in the great white north. This past Monday citizens from the province of Ontario amassed outside a municipality meeting in southern Toronto the firearms outlets. Canada store had. Purpose the building of an indoor firing range which could help satisfy a demand after many ranges were forced to close in 2008. The mayor at the time David Miller responded to your recent killing of John O'Keefe. By trying to have the city block gun manufacturers and wholesalers. From opening new facilities. And by closing recreational shooting range is on city property in Toronto. Nobody can deny that hobby directly results in people being shot and killed on the streets of our city. Miller states during the debate on gun owners haven't stopped trying to get more ranges up and running. Some 250 people arrived at the meeting in a lobby set up for half a hundred and Tony. On a more national level gun ownership license which is mandatory for the purchase of any firearm. Hit a high point of two million late 2015. After increasing trend from 2009. The company needs city permission to complete the project in the shopping plaza where his proposed but could open this year. As we discuss in multiple earlier episodes the trend for dead only minorities have begun to spike in the last year. Along with the election of president trump escalating tensions amongst nations. Along with both the perception and reality of escalated police violence in cases across the country are driving people toward a feeling of vulnerability. Among such groups are African Americans which. In 2014. Were listed as only 19%. Of the gun owning population in the United States. Recently. However the growth amongst groups such as the national African American gun association. Had grown dramatically. But never again has in the past year side more then 100% increase in its membership tally from November of 2015. And February of 2016. And currently totals in and about 181000. Members with 24 chapters now Philip Smith the president of the net again. Explains what he thinks is a driving force behind why people are taking up arms are. 24 months Jose tears fringe groups where does that fringe groups for now those fringe groups like it's cool to be a race. They've taken and we are pre season that's and it scares us. Another member of the group Shawn Campbell explained his belief in the second men hard. And he would favor the constitution so you've got some issues with the right people settle for both OK so yeah you could tell by the U Konami firearms haven't counted. Haven't counted I think that you know individuals that guarantees the right by the constitution itself. You know I think they should be able to avail themselves to that right. Over and I don't after the sandy hook shooting the nationwide. Reactions spark discussions. About the nature of security in our schools. While many of those discussions in didn't on the conclusion of more gun control two districts in Idaho decidedly different course of action. About four years ago just after the killing of multiple school children and their educators the garden valley school district. Located about fifty miles outside of Boise Idaho begin a discussion on the proposal of allowing guns inside your school. With only eleven deputies spread out over 2000 miles. Response times. Even ones in the case will be met shooter. Could be as lead as a 45 minutes. Years after the policy was approved and allow for each green and certified teacher should use one of the four rifles. Data stored in gun safes on campus. Now Mountain View school district also in Idaho have come to similar conclusions. Without the funds to pay for security they have allowed their teacher to volunteer security officers. After obtaining a concealed carry permit as well as some psychological and physical evaluations. The difference between the two policies is that one will allow teachers to carry a concealed handgun on them throughout the day. And then under Idaho State law it is completely. Within the school district's authority to ban or allow firearms on their campuses. Can this session is eight. How to milk that has been introduced which would allow the school board to Kennedy's firearms safety courses to students as a elective classes. And that is your global Denny's fourth district marched. Did thousands did. Sorry I'm sorry I didn't I didn't make that name my heart definitions of national Latin America. I'm sorry an association so I'll keep it that way I won't use the abbreviation. I itself. We're back talking with Gordon Cooper and Gordon is attorney with Texas and US law shields and now Gordon got a couple questions for it is is gonna be this you know this. The big round here and a bunch of questions so what if I remove alert and what if I move. So I have a I national firearms act item and I moved round at Texas and I moved in South Carolina. What's the process of me taken an item with me. So I'm I would give you a couple steps step number one. Make sure the state you're moving to allow you to bring that I don't would you I'm not every state has the same laws regarding. What kind of an academy you're allowed to do this which when you are. Some states allow none of them. Some states like everything that machine guest. Some states it became vacant very best interest rate stood up for every step one signature where you're going out lab that item. Even if you comply with the Vienna take us so let's say you are moving to a state that allows you to bring your item along. What you need to do before you move there if you and then. Believe it could be three Tony that 23. To be ATF which has. An update an address trivia items because they ATF always sort of now. Where is beside a restraining order that live where you don't answer you in uniform and they process that they can you let her back basically saying okay great thanks so it just now you can now move that. Now unfortunately we live in an imperfect world for people mess this up all the time. So if you do this you know if you knew anything take all got production and perform for my browser you can still send it in and yeah I would. Not to take a lie but it would be helpful if he's you know what future tense a that your mood that you made that capacitance pretty ATF purposes. But otherwise everything should be okay. Yeah except a customer that actually purchased item and we eat we get the form three from one gun store whenever till dealers to us central Texas gun works. And we have we are in possession of the item and now he's moving the act she is moving to South Carolina. So these are going ID was a low you can weigh into the text and comes in because we very done the form fours and wait for the text him to come in and he didn't you do that or. United I know yield option for. That's pretty much did because I mean the issue is at that point you have submitted a warm. He changed the ownership passed around to the Pentagon works to this guy and so for you to submit another form. To change it to a tougher sell in South Carolina. I would be having this can actually really when I dropped AD I have ATF on you that bad that right that's the way to do it it. Yet you can't do that percent to one side submitted the paperwork saying I'm transfer and for me to him I can't turn on to say okay we'll. Now the equity gonna transferred to another dinosaur it is technically how will not be in possession that I don't. It's you know what if they process that's paperwork in order. Correct OK okay all right so alone now what if I have to add or remove someone from the trust. Many did you add that if Tim name or remove a feminist. Yeah and it's it's very easy process. And then there's kind. Now rest. It there's that he ATF agent glistening I am now and wells are operating establishment. And the great secrets. Hillary did it add or subtract people from the trust it's just meaning your trust. Treaty process you basically just letter county newspaper. And make your lawyer blesses and everything slide. But the key on this process is that you don't have to update. ATF's every time you update desk at him for a year he didn't a year list of people who earn the trust so what this means is theoretically. If you didn't feel like gone through the hassle out. You know beating all your friends and family members if fingerprint and photograph. You can get yourself in contrast. Applied pretty I didn't get a true and it had everybody back on. Even though they were handed arms after the trust was approved. There's no requirement that they have to send their information and to be eight Kia. Even though they've been added on so. And then you could keep Agilent theoretically. Every time he wanted to buy a new item you just got everybody up by the items at a mall back arms. Well and that is all because in the HE a tool they never listed below requirement is specifically went out of the way not to. At the requirement that anyone added into the trust has to be fingerprinted photographed and background checked. It's now. If any ATF agents were Z wounds they gonna listen to my my thing can't it Kyrie that made it takes to support. So some people may say you know what my life are not as it is I'm not gonna reclaim this kind of weird dirty game according thought up. But for a lot of people it's it's a way to save on paperwork and travel fur on the lead you know individuals and can't wait just ball go get a fingerprint I'm. And so you know and trying to get rid of a loophole there's still a loophole. We'll get right so now I can IE three printed in FBI them. I do you definitely pulled him and especially with the press serious pretty much anything that. I reduces the report of the firearms so even an oil cruel terror foray water bottle taped and trying to do here. Your life or anything like that can become a compressor so. Yeah that's only 3-D print this stuff you still have to register. I'm now instead of using the warm core that we talked about earlier that is the transfer from the dealer to the individual. You have to have what's called a warm one. Which is safe and makers form. Philip PH yet no you're making this I. Now does not apply to machine and like we talked about earlier this machine guns are only those were manufactured or register prior to 1986. The first oppressors and things of that nature it's perfectly trying to duty prints a. Okay. An earlier were talking my 5320 got twenty. Yeah participants in between not that we not 23 and. He executed. Think you read these numbers enough they'll start to run again. And I just someone called someone actually sitting in the essence and so thanks Richard appreciate that right so now. I seek okay so what. What items like needs seemed to have marked you know done this my name's Annie two in greens or I don't have to get him in greens. You know how does that in grieving work. You have to be grieving process is already huge and there are a lot of folks because you know many of us know what a great rock and dad always semi ought to go and seek out by a court. Unless you're being greater in which case you're glad the people have to go through this arm. But. Potentially if you leading maker of an item he didn't have to get to trust name. The county and the state engraved on the items somewhere visible. Yeah a lot of people. Are hesitant to do they actually really nice is that the second that. But even so that's the requirement that the government puts that they got to go through it. What items are. Getting gray day I die to get mine is minus impresses engraved. Even if I mean anything you make you gotta giving grades you don't eat and still thought he got injured suppress surged you. Making a short barreled rifle if you do any of that. You have to butcher trust my name's Tony and stave off or somewhere. Keisel he Dylan -- ER and you know from scratch you know you do and as a struggle receiver you distilled essence crash PS BR then you're gonna have to give them engraved. Correct and chaos and now what if I hadn't. What if I need to have a gun Smith. Work on my firearm might NFA item so how does that work to lasting deal using with the ATF notify memory thing. So it's better than a situation where I would actually. Consider using formed three or some sort of wanted to transfer to them while they're working on it. Because you definitely don't look at them in the condition that. Having this item but no proof that they are the personally working on now it's it happens all the time where there are being fixed. Where you media to turn around in the back to the manufacturer. And sometimes manufacturers and try to play gotcha. Intel now the only candidate that's Seattle years older brother don't send it to let them and they can kind of trying to make it difficult but. You still have to follow that process. Because look at the end of the day they have to be able to lawfully possess it. OK so his best to do formed three Vienna senate to a gun Smith and lead against a decent work on it. Correct conditional necessarily have to. You know I'm I'm not a 100% sure on that one. I would I would feel very comfortable at filed against math would you take the item without any kind of paperwork saying that I will have to have it. Because the DH gets knocked down my door and I just cash suppressor lying around he's it's there's going to be a very long day. You got and then what might interfere and get stolen because we just spin just. It came across. One and he. Gun stores here in Austin and so when actually. Gone arranged and Stewart had there in a Fiat and some anything Adams actually in their vehicle. And and they were stolen out of the vehicle that's what I need to do and in the process like that I think it's stolen. Yes it happens all the time where people nearly but not at a Kattengell it's going to be fifty profit Jordan follow it step one immediately reported typically found because what you want to do is create a timeline. But when you lost possession of the item. Family and that was criminal received the national because if they go and may rob a liquor store and yell drop your suppressor on the ground that they detract back do you. You want something on the books somewhere saying I want so that's another on and so and so day. I holed out that's got to go and when we come back from the break and have you done finished answering that question would talk when Gordon Cooper. He's an attorney wood Texas in US lowest shield and we're talking Martha national firearms act process. This is Michael Cargill and you are listening to come talk to. Tell this is. FitzGerald already have the precinct three can't commissioner aaron's trial channel and you're listening to comment at all. Scott welcome back to come and talk at all. And now here's Michael Cargill right so we're back talking with Gordon Cooper and an attorney with Texas and US large shield as Ben Gordon is talking to us about the national firearms act process how all that stuff works I think it's a hands on me. Machine gun but a suppressor or Salinger mandatory field W any illegal weapons so that's what we're talking not me he's actually doing a great job of giving us all the you know all the ins and outs of that so Gordon was telling us about you know how old won't exactly what you need to do if you're in if the item was stolen. Going to go and. Yes so earlier. But I've told you you know make sure you call your local law enforcement make sure they know so bad if you know worse comes to worst meg I use it got its kind of crime. There's some kind of timeline as to when you've lost the guidance that way to know the bad guy wasn't he. Some additionally it is very very good idea to call the ATF and report to them that this NFA Adam has been stolen. And that way you know yes. You wind ATF lottery they wanna come inspect your item. It's not safe they sure could go worse they weren't bad and you're like oh I think it got stolen you know which never sounded good. They know at a time so they know to be on a watch out for as well. If you are an offense sell or a light duty you have or requirements if shore inventory stolen reported within 48 hours. For individuals so I would. Definitely suggest reporting it as soon as humanly possible that you need to get that I want to create it. Right now let's let's talk about that must talk about the Fourth Amendment hang as far as in the fee is concerned so Kim the ATF just in turn my whole so. If I own in if they item. In just you know walked in. Cheery in the very common question yeah I can do you hear that they're glad to inspect these items didn't really shuts off. You know your your kind of pork and and the alarms. Ignoring my aunt my side diatribe that's afforded them and has full all the treatment doesn't exist anymore I'm just very valid question are they'll have become whatever they want him and inspecting got the answer ultimately is yes they're allowed to inspect the items. But that doesn't mean negative buzz and your door one of the back here outs you know rip open the gun safe and take a look. That you really well what happens. They'll contact at a time the same covenant on Thursday at 3 o'clock. And I take a look at the DL. Short barreled shotgun you have for instance I knew they are cheer. I mean you can meet him at the door with the right it's not what he had a lot of crated all else may be got a really great you know Matt Glavin the cornerstone that you don't want to see. Somebody your jesuit realistically want to. But you could meet in that the door you can meet and outside he can be polite and courteous about it didn't and still have your fourth amendment rights Serb what's left of them intact. Think it right now let's talk about eight OW's real quick so as we can use that term deal WE Neal the weapons. What exactly are you OWs. Church so very. A wide variety of guns 400 at UW category. Most of them for example can be things that organs but don't look like got. So an umbrella that angrily at the trigger and she's had a clinic in bullet is an air deputy. Aid. Nice to had a secret and believe poll on medical cheats out. In the NATO Debbie I'm very common one that people sometimes try to tell us. Are these two wallet down and it's up a wall achieved cover that fits around your gonna make sure don't look like a wallet but it got a hole down the middle that lets you shoot it I can go on. Found that turns your item into an NOW do you think want to. Yeah he's got this wallet around undergone an if you haven't registered as well I'm surprised you've committed a felony. In the end I've seen people selling those that like gun shows and stuff. Yeah and it's probably harness so let's triple other you know and other Carney kind of special license or any kind of conclude anything because at the end of the day it's just. You know strip of leather but when you take extra good there and combine that with a god you haven't made. And failed deputy you've made a wallet that fire psychic on Neitzel right now. The I just real quick. A lot of people could instantly alarmed because they have these out of pocket pollsters. I'm so pocket pollsters have been very carefully designed to kind of run around this war. They have when he had begun to show on the front at a gun show on the top. Top of the gun shell and so if you had a pocket pistol when you have a pocket holster. Don't you know I think oh my god ya I've got this. They OW that you're talking about. You know it's it's specifically whenever you take its wallet style holsters and wrapped around your gun to make it look like a wallet up but it still fires. Okay so our teen had to go to Kenya and I turning to a guy and you'll make it fired you know around nine mil whatever. That's going to be Neil W you know the left of. Correct hopefully you registered it before you put it together corral but yes but you're correct. Frank has that I've seen people on FaceBook you know CEO went to this garage sale. And I economy and as I have these beautiful teen gun I'm like who that's anything item delete your post immediately. Come let's see. What about I saw does steel once of a guy that had a drone and he's flying these drone any attached a Glock to the drone. What do you think that is. Think that the bad idea. I can't imagine. You know that would be looked on favorably a lot of folks. You know even ignoring. Potential in the same issue aside I don't think there's any kind of official ATF going to address that directly I'm sure there will be the first time that becomes the issue. But I think yes terminate a very perspective it definitely puts you a legal gray areas to. Openly carrying handguns he had grown I don't think I district attorney would look kindly on behalf. OK now let's just talk about difference between zip guns and COW's. Pure and true things that you sound like a good traversing instead. Don't look like guns and actually our guns that guns may or may not look like farmer explicit sites or whatever. But. They are illegal under Texas law. So in the olden days under the old school sounds theoretically I don't know if anyone actually did desk. You could register and they give guns would be ATF slightly in detail items in it would be illegal under Texas law what it is they've done it. They need a farm that has been put together from pieces that were not originally firearm part. So for example I have my favorite examples educated enough. If you get some cute name in news futures up a wider and some you know I hairspray or whatever you make yourself as potato gun. Better than this guy and under Texas law formally if you were willing to spend 200 ducks got a potato gun you can trying registered to. In truth be told I don't know of anyone actually tried. I am but under current Texas Paula you've lost credibility. Altogether you can even registry would be nice way to make it legal or just flat out illegal. And we actually lost that right in the last session correct. Yeah and who is the nearest I don't know it was done on purpose or by accident but it's it's but as soon as we are the lurch where. These sort of their guns are legal now one kind of silver lining incurable Kyodo out of duty just. And is that it only counts toward an explosion sprayed projectile expelled by the force of an explosion. So if you and then it compressed data got to be okay. But don't give you know don't get flames and bald and he should be get out. And the exam week we get these deals that that come out of the Texas legislature and there's always those consequences of some of these bills in they don't really. Look at them really well and then we find out later on down the road once the bill goes and you know it becomes law. Then we say lol hole nine you know we've got about this what about this what about that known as happens when a lot of different things that happened with. Jack exactly what you just said you know with the potato gun happy with that it also happened to wind down campy scary you know would open Kyrie and stuff of that nature. And you know. People would totally shocked you know that all you can't open Kerry he and again. On a college campus on the street Sao walks walkways parking lot to Rogers. I have but she didn't know opened here he that he and end with a handgun license on the street Seles what we sparked a large Greisen an old school middle school high school. And in so is this what those consequences that you know and people don't feel pity these bills. And once they become long known that people totally shocked about what we in Dublin. And he is some things that we're talking about last week into would summon some bills and actually been filed in and then put out there. OK so. It's not all zip we'll how does that worked out O Gil de visas it guns and idols ago Israel w.s how does that word Gordon. Well know how they are completely different animal altogether I'm formally I would tell you that. All they've gotten there w.s so not only OW needed guns and I'll tell you leaders made it home maker because they've got into an IOW and and say OWs. Even I mean if he somehow managed to put them together from pieces that are harmed our execution come mechanical genius. I'm building that in Texas because that they've done this is no good. And okay now sold so got to tell us what once again. Compare the old rules Texas rules to the new rules now when it comes in if they items. Sure her book tour and the key point of all let you know other than that do you loss of the ability registers its guns theoretically that the ATF. The other huge you know changes are that there are no longer that. Individual requirements to get cheaper for enforcement officers signature which is he's not ever get your form back Deb because you're chief. Law enforcement officer won't sign it you know this huge impediment to a lot of folks and now. All that's required notification. I'm confident they'll think things are required of people any trust or corporation that are so called responsible person or persons that are able to address. It's her you know met with the items so to speak. Those people also have to youth. Notified they're chief law enforcement officer fans do you fingerprinted get photographed. And the ATF gonna run a background check to check on the so those nerves are the biggest changes to that process you know from just the past year. I and then once she gets you finally get that tax stamps you know and it takes a little while. I like we're seeing earlier fear purchasing that item from meet different if until dealers may be a totally different state somewhere else. That items can be transferred to use your local F until dealer I think he's a form three for that. And then once he gets to that local dealer you fill out the form for any start that process and it takes time for that young doesn't happen right away. That the form three approval takes about thirty days maybe a little longer depending on how much paperwork they have going on there who or how many people on vacation. And he won't support the and it's true to form for. Who is going to be there's no telling how long is gonna take feast or form for approve right now because rate I think the last tax stamps I received word. May of last year and that they return in May of last year. And so we're actually getting those text him back so there's really no telling how long it's gonna take because of what happened July 13. With the new rules that went into effect a lot of people turn and paperwork to get. Their solitary dessert wolves oppressors. The giggles approved soon it kind of backed up the system a little bit. And so I'm. In iso Gordon that's how we come back from the break and they have new you know kind of sum things up and maybe talk about some things I didn't ask you. I wanna make sure we you know trying to. I think we answered everyone's questions they were typing to me online for different. FaceBook pages yeah I think we got Althea all of those questions out. But a definite what you mean she's been that we did not talk about what talk would Gordon Cooper attorney with Texas and US Lola shields and we're talking about the national firearms act. Process this is Michael Cargill and you are listening to come and talk. Industry representatives John undertake a little bit of a sudden you're listening to common at all it is on talk thirteen eleven weeks. And and then from then from. Wimbledon. Welcome back to common socket. And now here's Michael kargil has spread had not place and we're gonna take you dear you know gonna make sure that you're able to use. Get the item that you want you want dad and that automatically wanna get the machine gun you want to not be able cease fire years. Yeah they are fifteen by using. 'cause salad served. You know we're gonna help you today then and I hope we're able to answer all your questions but let me go back to my my co host here tonight. Yes those lies like mine you know she's my my cougar cocoa and suffer the spokesman Gordon you know are you married. There's little need be very angry attracts certain. Our camp I suspect I better get to that I'm getting ready hook you up you know because like denies my cougar and so you know. At Sony and she has. Jesus awesome woman she's the businesswoman and that's really she's just she. She is or about here is that the sense of power in just a forty. And dismay and eat eat you talked to deny it and some people intimidated and by that you know it's but she's awesome co host and and she's an awesome woman. Was actually giving it you are in if you weren't you married I was deftly done and integration to. But I'll back down now and I'm when he gets in trouble at. It's a Gordon act tell me. A little bit you tell me some things that I didn't ask you then. Yes so one thing I did when it attached background we talked about a little earlier and I wanted to circle back on I'm just. Make sure I didn't mess anything up I'm more we talked about sending sounds. Class three items are you know deadline as we've been talking that in a bad back or repair repair only. I'm it is not necessarily require transferred but it is at least suggested by those myself in the ATF. Found that individuals can collapse perform five knots or three good formed five. Found that lady preparer has been Billy say hello you know I've. I've got the item here's my people show like they don't actually run upheld a law. But it just wanna go and touch on that went out you know it's formed side and that it only applies for repairs so if you. Want to get some other modification done to the firearms the net as they also have a bag of worms than just sitting back for repair and if you send it off a modification. Without killing at any paperwork you put the recipient of very tough spot he found that is what they wanted to catch back up. And he absolutely because we get that question sometimes to united honestly I didn't didn't really answer that question at all to be honest with you. Right so I'm mental so Gordon's. Oh how are you when you graduated. And university Houston. It so I was eighteen my MIA undergrad and then I wasted a good solid year working in and doing that and I finally got back in the law school and got outlawed school when I was 22. Yeah I could've done it at 21 if I had you know put my nose to grindstone and our debt. I guess I'm makes apple look at all. None none I think that's awesome you know the fact that she you know he actually went teen to college at thirteen I think he's just great. So how did you how did you fear that you know was it was hard for you adapting to the the Carl's life and then each. No it's fine for me ever wonder if I was like you get a yes. Yeah ironically that was the same major anywhere in Gary and I can't get steady at some bar to be like well. You know not only cannot get and I don't have a driver like him guest. I'm so there are a lot of those kind of surprised situations but not for the most part of when you assume knows you have your average short college student. I think in the garden how I'm curious how old were you when your parents realize you were. Gifted so to speak you're pretty intelligent. Well they started home schooled me around ten. And then I think I just got sick in the things they told me to go try to college entrance exam. They're like you know what we'd there's nothing we can tell you. It's not so I came greet your papers so we're here is innocent young. I think they get got tired of my Smart Aleck attitude and her right ear don't go to the university eastern. You don't come across as mean that's Smart Alec yet she pretty laid back here and you know pretty quiet maybe it's gonna just on the lead that lonely and had a couple drinks yet. It's a different and that's you get nuance sometimes you'll you'll get a couple quick service. Okay you haven't read it. All right so I'm and that anything else that we didn't mean and nasty Gordon. No I think whatever comes into patterns you know they're the key is always PlayStation because this is a very serious crime. Say they felony you know if convicted you lose your right to buy again forever at the very awful crime to be convicted out. You want to make sure you do everything right delegate gap you know the beginning his most careful times. Signing anything and especially television academy so if you ever have a question. About how existing rights former MI committing this right ask don't make any assumptions whatsoever. Yet because of things and I see on FaceBook that things that I see on Twitter. I ate it really scares me sometimes it in as things that people tell all the people and I won't know. And go talk to your attorney talked to an attorney. How do not listen to someone on line you know what their advice is a what they think you're supposed to be a deal with certain things definitely consult an attorney. You know would a lot of those questions were all of them actually. They admit they're even a lot of gun stores that are stuck in like there I don't know like the eighteen hundreds the united still don't fax machines. I mean there are some gun stores we we have the pull teeth to get information out of sometimes. Around the country it's really frustrating yes like hey you know a key it just simple things like send us a copy of their F a film. And though like. What we can only fax and email to me now just fact that it would just find I'm faxed to me then. He knows this it's it's really hard sometimes so. Definitely check with your attorney alone bee stings you know I I go to my attorney at Texas a US law shields with everything. And you know if something happens you know with Martha elite have a question inside the gun store and I actually contact Texas and US law she'll get those answers is also a nice book this out there. And I want Gordon tells about that book because that book is the Bible to me. It has a lot of information in it and on. What's the name of that book Gordon. Yes it is armed and educated in its abrupt put together by Texas law shields bit. Anything you need to know about harms law as a Texaco and you know if you read from cover to cover entertainment information and you are. You're gonna go it's coming it's exhausting how much information that the. It's it's a lot because I you can find out you know full well that the common question is can I should but god and myself. And to myself you know within the state of Texas you know that's a common question. And yell and then how do I go about shipman if I can do it heal this book tell you those answers it it it's a lays a list without teeth. CD deafening when you take a look at his book it's a really good reference you can put tabs in any and everything. Think that information. I won't Gordon. I want to thank you for coming on the show the Dane spinning your Sunday afternoon with this. And definitely have a wonderful resting your weekend. I will thank you all for having me it's always a pleasure. Archer. In Austin, Texas after City Council basically banned Hoover and lift from this city for not following deer over reaching rules and regulations. Sting operations were conducted to try and catch their employees in the act. Now the city of Boston of course wasn't the only bureaucracy. Not to crack down on the innovations of over in other ride sharing services the company has had difficulties in other cities like Portland. Parents. Can yeah. Boston. Las Vegas in other international. And national scene he's making it more difficult for the company to expand its service. Hooper has been responding to these difficulties in multiple ways marks the more interesting tactics they use a tool called gray ball. Great ball allows Colbert to pick up on law enforcement in other individuals trying to violate their terms of service by tracking past activity. OB app. Banking account information. Social media information and other training data picked up from the user's phone. Now if the application has been open multiple times in close proximity to a government building. Or if the bank details on the account holder linked T institutions like eight police credit union the phone is quote great ball. Once the phone was tag it was difficult if not impossible to get a driver to pick you up. Now routers with these tags phones would see either no billable vehicles or would use ghost drivers any fake version of the app. If the driver was already assigned they would easily cancel the ride once notified of the great bowl status. Now some cold enforcement agencies starting. They started buying dozens of phones to create fake accounts that had not yet been great ball. Now over employees responded by going to local electronics stores. And looking up the device numbers of the cheapest phones for sale to flag them early on. The legality of this operation is a bit spotty but everything considered. They've been left with little choice. So good job over and way to stick it to the man. It is always more guns equals less crime. Gone by yourself would get even listen to come and talk it. With Michael Cargill. Chief George.